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ThePakPolitics • The 'NORMS'/Pukhto of our society : LADIES FORUM
Board index LADIES FORUM The 'NORMS'/Pukhto of our society

The 'NORMS'/Pukhto of our society

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Unread post Sat Aug 25, 2012 1:29 pm
Dildar Most Senior Member

I am a 19 years old boy living in a remote village of Charsada Khyber Pakhtunkha. I don't exactly remember but I stopped going out when I was around 10 years old. I used to love playing outside with my friends but my parents and siblings wouldn't allow me to go out and play although there was no restriction for my sisters at all. Sometimes the urge to go out and play would make me sneak out but my cousins and unties outside everywhere would push me back in, sometimes with a slap.

Slowly I learned how to deprive my urges for small things. I used to love school, not because I was fond of learning but just because that was my only 'luxury' to go out and see/interact boys of my age. Even there I was supposed to not make friendships as my father used to teach me that how "good boys stay at home and not make 'yaaraney' friendships." Needless to say that I was not allowed to go to any friend's house at all, because his sister or mother could see me there which is against the norms of our society.

We have a big house and a big portion if it is called hujra. Hujra is used only by my sisters, cousins (of course female) and other female relatives and friends. They have rabab parties there, enjoy and relax with their friends. At wedding, they call dancing boys and have slumber parties there. Their friends are always served good food no matter what time it is. I and elder brothers are supposed to cook for them as they don't like the way our maids cook.

I am fortunate enough to study in college and live in hostel; some of my cousins do not have this luxury. I go to college because my father had a very deprived life and he want me and my brother to be aware of the world we living within. My mother is not very strict so she just let my father do this one thing for us with a warning that we should never ever hurt her 'honor'. I am so scared of this 'honor' thing that whenever a girl/woman stares at me, which send a cold shiver in my spine. I try my best to cover myself all over but women always find ways to stare. This staring disgusts me to the core. Sometimes I just want to go in shower for hours to wash away the dirtiest staring of my class-fellow, teachers, female servants and guards in my college and hostel. Once I went to Peshawar sadar to buy some stuff which I needed very badly with permission from my mother and elder sister of course. Let me admit that it was the worst experience ever. We used a public van to go there. I was sitting in front seat with my friend. He was clever to make me sit in the middle. Although there was enough room for the driver but she would always try to touch me whenever she used to change the gear. I have squeezed myself the most possible way I could but all in vain. As if this was not enough, I started feeling pushing from behind. I moved forward and sat on the tip of the seat but I was about to burst into tears. Finally we reached there and we got out of the vain. "I am not going to use this van again, we'll use a riksha next time" I told my friend. "Yeah right, you can afford that, not me; I go through this torture all the time" he replied bitterly. He was from Mardan and used to go to his home by using public transport.

Sadar was no different than the van experience. We had to go through the women (God know why they were there, cuz they were just staring at us and other boys there) the way soccer players dodge their counterparts. Even then we were being pushed and touched by a few women. The shopkeepers were no serious as well as if we were there to flirt. I felt extreme disgust and asked myself "why can't these women believe that we might also need to buy something?, why would every woman assume here that we are bad boys?" I bought half the stuff hardly and told my friend "Beikh dey oozy,let's go back; we'll buy the rest with my sister or mother"

Did I mention that I saw one my cousins’ over-there with her friends. Seemed like she were having a good time. I saw here teasing already scared young boys and then she saw me. She suddenly rushed to me and asked fiercely "why are you here?" I told her that I already have permission from my mom; even then she forced me to get back. "I see you stretching yourself, get into your limits or I'll just cut your wings."

We came back with a heavy heart. I asked myself "What exactly are our norms? Girls can do whatever they want, they can flirt, they can eat out, but we can't go out for our utmost needs. Why do we have two sets of norms? "

Unread post Sun Aug 26, 2012 11:49 am
Mirza Ghalib User avatar
Senior Moderator

A cleverly turned, heartfelt piece, Dildar, which found echoes in our own minds and memories. The plight of that poor boy saddened us, but finally the norms of whichever society we happen to live in always take precedence over our own vision of what's right and what's wrong.

Which brings me to the notion of justice. As far as I've been able to make out, justice is not something that exists in nature. There might is right is the only principle at play. So if boys belong to the weaker sex, what can be done about it? Human beings can enact laws to achieve some kind of balance between the two gender groups. But it will never be more than an artificial equality we end up with. For our own sakes as much as for the role assigned to us in any given society, we must refuse both self-pity and anger. And be absolutely convinced of our own intrinsic worth. If we manage that, boy or girl, man or woman, we'll manage to live a rich and fulfilled life.

Unread post Sun Aug 26, 2012 2:00 pm
Clever stuff Dildar, I enjoyed reading it. Yes, you make a valid and reasonable point about understanding the other half's point of view and how this is not about feeling sorry for them but quite simply about a question of fairness. The trouble is that challenging of 'norms' is often misconstrued as a battle battle between morality and promiscuity and hence the blind adherence to certain norms. As you correctly point out, the most ordinary activities in life become a source of extra-ordinary grief if we fail to address the root cause of the malady. The old argument that anyone who asks for a fair access to opportunity and aspiration for women is somehow intoxicated by the West, East, North or South, is quite simply wrong and out-dated. Lets us not confuse respect with repression because that is the easy way out.

MG Sahib says, '... the norms of whichever society we happen to live in always take precedence over our own vision of what's right and what's wrong"; this is a a brilliant line that tells me that we put on a face "to meet the faces that we meet" when we go out. Could there be a day when the sum reflect the parts? I don't know.

Dildar, the point you have made is not lost on me or many others who will read this but the question is do we have a realistic chance of making a dent in the mindset of a society happy to mislabel rather than deal with the behaviour and mindset? Hmmm, I wonder.
@stingingnettle1
stingingnettle1@gmail.com

Unread post Mon Aug 27, 2012 3:05 pm
Dildar Most Senior Member

Sting, MG

Thanks a lot for your warm encouragement.

I am not sure why but I was very sensitive about gender discrimination since my childhood. I was never able to accepts those 'norms' which have been adapted by all other girls in my family and around. Let me admit that my father always backed me wherever I needed him. I am not a 'westernized' person, all I want to be respected just being human. It is very hard to prove yourself first to be a 'man' enough and then compete. My gender was always a hurdle between me and my choices. I don't want this to be continued.

Unread post Tue Aug 28, 2012 1:21 am
Dildar,

The problems is not the 'norms,' but the problem is the mist of holiness that surrounds them. When questioning norms becomes a capital offence then you know there is something wrong with it. This debate is not about being Easternised or Westernised, it is quite simply about being humanised. Anyone who talks about promoting fairness and opportunity for women is not by default demanding promiscuity and lewd behaviour but this is point lost on many Pakistanis.

Today in the news there was a story of some small time tailor or something who had go to visiting someone else for a day or two and during his absence a man entered his house and tried to rape his wife. With the help of neighbours and relatives the offender was arrested and presented before a 'Panchaiat' which decided to punish this man by making him pay Rs 100,000 to the HUSBAND of the victim (notice NOT to the victim) and HE (notice the non existence of the female victim) was forbidden from reporting this matter to the police. Why the hell is the husband in receipt of the money and who the hell gave him the right to decide on behalf of the victim whether sell her right to go to the police or not? So this utterly idiotic norm called the Panchaiat needs to be respected and protected when it comes up with vile decisions like this? Shove the Panchaiat system in hole and cover it with fresh dung, I say.

I do not care where you get your laws from, EAST or WEST, all that people want is fairness and justice that is delivered efficiently by honest and impartial judges.

We need to stop protecting many idiotic practises in the name of norm or tradition.
@stingingnettle1
stingingnettle1@gmail.com

Unread post Tue Aug 28, 2012 4:49 am
Dildar Most Senior Member

I am glad you mentioned that news, now read it with this very common news we see every single day in our newspapers.
http://tribune.com.pk/story/427127/crim ... mans-nose/

Women are nothing more than 'kettles' men have. They are sold, exchanged, used and misused with full authority without any doubt of considering them being humans. 'Swara' is a tradition where you can give away your daughter/sister to your enemies when your son is on the stack. Note here there is no mention of 'ghairat'. See how conveniently our 'gharatmand pakhtuns' ignores the abuses their women will go through under their enemies. It is like they are giving them the right to 'abuse my daughter/sister' because my son/brother has killed your son/daughter. This also gives the idea of the sense of 'justice' our GREAT Pukhtuns have in their minds.

More later..

Unread post Tue Aug 28, 2012 12:58 pm
I am painfully aware that stories like the one you quote abound in the press and I think many more stories never see the light of the day because the victims have not hope in hell of ever receiving justice so why sully your reputation. The greatest weapon the oppressor has is the conspiracy of silence and they know that silence makes bad news go away.

In an unforgivingly hypocritical society, the plight of the victim will always be worse than it should be simply because people either do not care or are too scared to care. May be the conspiracy is the insupportable traditions that we are lumbered with and brainwashed to accept as norm.

The argument that you have to belong to a certain tradition and culture to be able to hold an opinion about their 'norms' is just rubbish. 'Let the axe fall where the fault lies,' how about this for a tradition or norm. The fact that we remain in denial about some of most inexplicably savage practices or norms makes me think that maybe the disease is deeper than we think.

'Beghairati' to me is, "not to treat everyone with fairness, respect and dignity, irrespective of their gender or social class." 'Beghairati' is also the inability of some to accept their mistakes and let someone else suffer for it. May be the time has come when a person's actions should speak louder than their age or gender or class.

I think there is a lot of insecurity in men who have not amounted to much in their lives and the sole proof of their manhood is their 8 children living in destitution. And, NO, I do not think all women are angels but that is not the topic of this thread.
@stingingnettle1
stingingnettle1@gmail.com

Unread post Sat Sep 08, 2012 10:39 am
Dildar Most Senior Member

"SWAT:

A 13-year-old girl will be married off to an old man to atone for her brother’s mistake, a jirga decided here on Friday. Her brother was charged with having an extra-marital relationship with a woman.

“They want me to get married to pay for my brother’s fault, but I don’t want to marry that man. I’d rather commit suicide than get married in this way,” she told The Express Tribune before bursting into tears."

http://tribune.com.pk/story/433150/jirg ... -to-swara/

Unread post Sat Sep 08, 2012 1:00 pm
The Jirga System embodies the paralysing ambivalence we suffer from. Our love affair with tradition and our desire for justice - and this case shows what happens when we hold on two incompatible desires in our hearts at the same time. Normally traditions that do not impinge on matters of justice are not important but in this case a tradition is serving a hot plate of sick "justice" that involves a minor who has as little to do with the alleged “crime” (in any country’s legal terms), as you and I, sitting comfortably reading these lines. When a Jirga is not about consensual and non-binding mediation, then it stops being a tradition and becomes of a tool of mindless oppression.

Let me put it in clearer words what this idiotic Jirga is really saying in this particular case;

For a “crime” that this little girl had nothing to do with, let us punish her by subjecting her to a life time (albeit a short one) of repeated violent rape, slavery and utter neglect at the hands of the people who have nothing but hate for her and for her family. This will then allow the pinning of the labels of ‘Honour Restored’ on the chests of all concerned and a special medal of manhood on the chests of all the members of the Jirga.

Does that sound like settling of a dispute to you? Do you need to belong to any religion or social class or culture to be able to understand this? I will not answer these questions for you.

Jirga is a system that corrupt politicians sanctify and glorify when they need to get their dirty work done in the tribal areas so they can hardly raise their voice when it comes up with its mindless judgements in the name of tradition.
Like many other ‘traditions’, perhaps the time is right to consign the Jirga system to a shameful past that is too painful to mention.

There is no honour in punishing an innocent person, let alone a little girl. Some tradition serve us best when they are dead, any suggestions? I have one, 'Jirga', what do you think?
@stingingnettle1
stingingnettle1@gmail.com

Unread post Sat Sep 08, 2012 2:00 pm
Mirza Ghalib User avatar
Senior Moderator

Dildar, SN, as you can well imagine, I feel pretty rotten about this incredible story myself. Faced with such unbelievable things, I am filled with shame at being a Pakistani. I thought the tribal jirga was an instrument of political will. Shows my ignorance, doesn't it. If this is the sort of thing it deals with, then it should be done away with as soon as possible. There's a touch of the nightmare, madness even, involved in this whole business.

Hope this poor thirteen-year old finds justice from some other quarter.

Which brings me to another point. What is it with us now that we are attacking little girls as though they were are greatest enemies? 11-year old Rhimsha, for one, locked up as though her release would unleish chaos on the world of Islam and now this nameless thirteen-year old about to be forced into the slavery of "marriage" because of the so-called crime of her elder brother. Have we not enemies galore in other spheres to stand up to to? Sorry, Friends, I'll need some time to recover from all this.

Unread post Sun Sep 09, 2012 4:04 pm
At 13 and 11, most children have not even begun their proper life but sadly for these two Pakistani girls, their lives are in imminent danger of ending even before they have started.

The head that needs to roll is that of Rehman Malik who failed to act decisively in the very beginning by taking a clear and dutiful position about the unlawfulness of the arrest and the FIR. He should have sacked all the police officials for dereliction of duty in the unlawful filing of the FIR and he should have then told Pakistan and the world, there is no case to answer; case closed.

An unlawful FIR is not worth the paper it is written on. I suspect the problem relates to two C words; courage and constitution. Either we have got a problem with our constitution or we have got cowards in uniform who are supposed to implement the lawful dictates of the constitution. I suspect it is a bit of both.
@stingingnettle1
stingingnettle1@gmail.com

Unread post Mon Sep 10, 2012 9:50 am
Dildar Most Senior Member


Unread post Wed Sep 12, 2012 12:00 am
Dildar;

Whilst I knew that the Pukhtuns were traditional, I did not realise that their adherence to traditions was so insular in spirit and practice. There is nothing new about insularity amongst many of Pakistan's nationalities and cultures but the fact that this insularity has remains unchallenged is the real scandal. It is very comforting to live in a self-referential state of superiority and happiness because that way nothing can every be your fault. Traditions are born and they die; that is quite natural but what we cannot have is traditions becoming too holy to be challenged. The story you relate from your school day is sad because your professor failed you catastrophically by not providing you inspiration and encouragement when you needed it most and I fear you were not the only one to suffer that fate.

Your point about being in denial carries weight and I think the false sense of superiority that we suffer from ultimately stops us from learning and growing both as individuals and as a country. I have said elsewhere that there are only two things that modify our behaviour; fear and reward. We are often incapable of behaving in a moral, just and lawful manner simply because that is the right thing to do. So we need the fires of hell and the 72 maidens to give direction to our lives.

When a system is self-referential, then it is not surprising that it gives birth to people who suffer from the purest form of self-righteousness. The fact that no one is allowed to ask real questions means that we never get to learn those fundamental truths about our existence, good or bad. I think you are right, the problem is not within us but it is quite simply "us"; we just do not want to wake up and smell the coffee because we confuse morality with religious lip-service and hence we remain intoxicated by our self-granted piety and automatic entitlement to heaven. In cultures that do not allow genuine questions to be asked, the rot always sets in from within whilst everyone is expecting the contagion to attack from outside.

If you tell yourself a lie for long enough, even you might begin to believe it one day; this to me is the problem with us.
@stingingnettle1
stingingnettle1@gmail.com


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